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Natura Expands Recall

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  1. Jennifer

    I just saw this post and I just called Natura because I give my cat canned California Natural and the representative said that the recall was only for the dry food for both cats and dogs.

    So I just wanted to tell everyone that the recall is only for the dry products.

    1. yasamin

      I have two cats they were very healthy UNTIL I gave them Evo wet food chicken with high in protein and low carb both cats became severely sick DO NOT USE EVO AGAIN

      1. Chris

        I feed EVO 95 chicken and turkey canned and have had no problems. Suddenly switching foods and overfeeding can both cause illness.

        If you suspect it’s the food you need to contact the company, save uneaten food and cans or packages and have your pets examined immediately.

  2. Bernie Winegrad

    Hi Susan. Just read the list of recalled products and found I’ve been feeding my cats Innova Turkey and Chicken treats from one of the lots listed as potentially contaminated. Any idea what the symptoms of salmonella might be in cats and dogs (yes, my dog had some too). How long after eating affected product before symptoms appear? Wrote company, but no response.

    1. nanette

      diarrhea,bloody stool,lethargic,not eating,flu like can get it too.if you touched the food.been in the pet food sales 20 yrs,i new the family that started natura.they took alot of heat when they sold out to proctor and gamble.i took my pets of this food when they bought it.will not support animal testing,they are the biggest at that.i was wondering when they mess it up.

  3. Karin Badger

    Thank you So much for what you do here. I would NEVER know, if not for your email posts. I just bought some of this EVO cat food 2 days ago, now on a recall list. My cat has been sick twice, which he cannot afford, being diabetic with renal failure. I am furious. I was wary to buy this new bag (I usually purchase this cat food), but the person at the store said they alway take the recalled food out right away, but that salmonella didn’t affect animals, only humans, so thought the recall was unnecessary!!! I am bringing this back to the store tomorrow.
    Thank you!

  4. Nancy Lockman

    I also feed EVO dry kibble to a cat recovering from severe injuries.
    AND just bought a brand new bag this week that appears on the recall.
    I am furious. I fell for the almost innocent response to the earlier recall…

    Thank you for letting us know. I am taking the bag back to the store.
    And my dog undergoing CHEMO stole some of it from the cat’s kennel.

    1. yasamin




  5. Ellie

    I often wonder how many stores actually comply with these recalls. I have asked store managers in the past about product recalls and they have told me they were unaware of any information about a recall. Since most consumers are not keeping up on these recalls either it seems much of this could be slipping through the cracks.

    1. Michelle

      I cannot speak for everyone, but as an owner of a small independent store we had all of products of of the shelf and stored in the backroom by 4:30 or 5:00 yesterday. Had also called everyone who may have purchased a recalled product and notified them, some of which were returned and a different food was purchased before we closed at 6. We were notified by one of our distributors (not the one we get the food from) even before dog food advisor sent out a notification. The big box stores chain of command can slow things down – but no cracks being slipped through with most independents.

      1. Ellie

        It sounds like you are on top of it. It’ is the chain stores that I would have the most doubt about.

        1. sebs

          I agree & this is why i avoid chain stores. By the time head office gets the email regarding a recall, then maybe gets around to checking it that day or maybe the next, if they have time maybe the next day or day after that maybe they’ll get around to sending it to store managers the next day. Then maybe the day after that the store manager will get around to checking the email. Small privately owned stores are the way to go. No chains of command a mile long. Plus the store owners have put more care into the products they sell to begin with,not just what will make them $$$

          1. Jan

            I live in a small town in Canada and Pet Smart had it off the shelves right away so if that’s being done in Canada so quickly it must be being done in the US. But the cashier said that she heard it was because of cobwebs being in the bag(!). Wonder who told her that.

          2. Ellie

            I don’t want to name the chains I talked to but they are quite well known. I suppose it depends a lot on who manages the store and if they are paying attention.

    2. yasamin


  6. Jean Francisco

    Please send any info I fee innova and chicken soup for pet lovers soul foos to my dogs

  7. PJ

    “True to our heritage, we will be transparent as we work through this issue.” Proctor & Gamble anyone? Don’t believe Natura has ever had a quality problem….until now! P&G recently bought New Chapter organic supplement company. They just had a recall in the last 60 days. Just sayin’.

    1. Michelle

      Yes I wondered what “heritage” is was they were being so true to.

  8. Mike

    In defense of Natura this was an expanded recall. They never had a recall in 21 years up til now. Point is, Natura is a good company and they make excellent foods. My cats will still eat evo can, but I will switch to Halo dry. This latest recall was expanded as of yesterday. This recall was from a line in the USA. We all know it happens in human food production as well. I work in the Pharmaceutical industry, which always have recalls. It happens, you can always check the FDA website for recall updates.

    1. Liz

      Years ago, I fed my dog EVO. Natura was a small company. They were bought out by Proctor & Gamble. I home cook now. No more commerical dog food for us. Even the Mother Nature dog biscuits have changed and I can’t feed those anymore either.

    2. nanette

      was a good company until proctor and gamble bought it 3 yrs ago.anything they touch turns to poison. they support animal testing with your funds of buying this would happen,they cheapened it somewhere at your expense.i new the family that started this bad the sold to evil.

  9. […] Evo Turkey Chicken Cat Food, the company wrote in a letter to retailers posted on watchdog website The expanded recall comes after Salmonella was found in other packages of Evo Turkey Chicken Cat […]

  10. cat health

    […] & Chicken Cat Food, the company wrote in a letter to retailers posted on watchdog website The expanded recall comes after Salmonella was found in other packages of Evo Turkey & Chicken […]

    1. Jayne

      Thanks for sharing that info, Chris. I’m a little stunned but guess I shouldn’t be. How on earth did you find that little news item?

  11. CM

    Immediately after the first Natura recall, I sent an email them to ask if any of their Evo cat treats were involved in the recall and their reply assured me that I could “continue to feed Evo Wild Cravings Weight Management Cat Treats with confidence”. I should have known better. NEVER AGAIN!!!!

  12. Tom

    I have been feeding my dog Innova Chicken and Turkey small bites. He is very ill. He is on his way to see the veterinarian shortly. All of his symptoms seem to indicate enteritis. Hence, I must assume salmonella virus from the Innova dog food to be a possible source for this issue. The bag of Innova dog food did indeed come from an affected lot. However, the 15 pound packaging size is not listed in the recall. This product is a bio-hazard to be taken as a serious health threat to pets and their handlers even if the FDA and Natura do not. My local Petco had never even been informed about this matter.

    1. Ellie

      Yup. That’s one of them.

      1. Tom

        Ellie, We’ve seen the veterinarian. Without a fecal occult, salmonella is impossible to confirm. Nonetheless, it was agreed that all of my dog’s symptoms are indicative of salmonella virus infection. Just as important, it seems the Department of Agriculture in my state is very much ready to perform the necessary testing of Natura products and will commence tomorrow.

        1. Nancy

          Good news about your state!

  13. Pet Owner

    These Recalls really, for those that know something about the industry and animal biology, are for OUR safety. Cats and dogs are completely equipped to deal with these small amounts of salmonella, they run into it all the time scrounging around the world. Wash your hands and you’ll be fine, and if your animal’s sick, it’s 99% likely its not from the food unless it’s already severely immuno-suppressed. Far too many people blame salmonella recalls for pet’s health issues and all it is really is big business for Vet’s when people do.

    1. Nancy

      This post upset me. I DO have a dog undergoing chemo, a household member with a Crohns Disease and a cat with a neuro injury. IF ALL pet food contains salmonella, it should come with a warning for ALL OF US to beware or to be aware of the danger to us.
      As for the bag of IVO I bought, I had divided it between 5 cats. They had eaten it before I saw the recall. AND their litter box was full of big blobs of poop instead of their usual normal stool. Just saying…
      It is as if when we speak up, it is just us or our money-grabbing vets wanting dollars. I had dogs become ill with another “salmonella” recall for another brand. We treated the dogs, but did not choose to spend the dollars required to test and prove that was the cause. I spent it on their care instead.
      So if we have an animal who is on chemo or a family member with compromised immune system, is it not possible to trust and use commercially prepared pet food? Rhetorical question…
      My apologies for my bad mood and grumpy response to this.

    2. Happy dogs

      Nice comments. Dogs and cats have different stomachs then humans. They can eat a dead carcass a dead mouse dogs can bury a raw bone and come back to it later. My friend lost her lab and found him 16 months later he survived on state land eating wild animals, dear carcass and who knows what else but the dog survived! He was full of fleas and worms when found but he was alive. It’s an amazing story. And yes humans need to wash their hands when handling dog food, all good points thanks for posting. Research a dogs stomach acid and see why they can eat dead carcass.

      1. Pet Owner

        Thank you, this is all I was saying. My “credentials”, if needed, are thousands upon thousands of hours managing a Pet Specialty store. My Customers are my Main concern, but it is a FACT that dogs are able to handle these small amounts of salmonella occasionally.

        1. Happy dogs

          Another point: are we as pet owners destroying our pets stomachs? More and more humans as well as domestic dogs and cats have acid reflux and sensitive stomach problems. Our food in this day and age is GMO it’s a pesticide factory of and in itself. What is this doing to our/our pets stomachs? Our food chain has changed since the 1920’s. We care about out pets and do for them sometimes better then we do for ourselves, yet what we do for ourselves isn’t that great because we have no little to no control over what is happening to our food chain because it’s being forced on us. A label may say Human grade chicken but did those chicken eat GMO corn? If so then what effect is that having on us and our pets. We are all living in this merkie ses pool we can only do the best that we can do. As the scriptures say “man has dominated man to his injury” Ecc 8:9

  14. Tom

    Dear Pet Owner, I am interested to know what your credentials might consist of and if you would like to sign a sworn statement reflecting the opinion represented.

    1. Happy dogs

      Which pet owner are you addressing Tom? And why would anyone sign a statement for their opinion? This is a discussion list not a court trial.:) Lol

      1. tom

        Dear Happy Dogs,
        I took the wording from the “Pet Owners” posting on 4/2 at 3:28 PM to be statement of fact. Additionally, it seems to me that the same individual, through no fault of their own, bears a conflict of interest regarding the sale of various pet products assuming you have read the additional entries Pet Owner has posted.

        I gather from the thread of this blog that there are a lot of consumers who are comfortable with unknown amounts of zoonotic material in the pet products they purchase. I have clearly miscalculated the intent of this forum by adding my comments. I apologize for that.

        Indeed this is not a court trial.

        The outstanding fact is that this recall was initiated voluntarily meaning that had Natura not responded to government test results, the recall would have been court ordered. The recall has now been expanded two times.

        Litigation is pending.

  15. Chris H.

    My pet food retailer says canned EVO 95 cat food shipments are being delayed by the manufacturer. Anyone know why?

    1. Jan

      Thier canned food is not made by them at their facility, only their dry is. They have another company making the canned food for them. So no idea why the canned would be delayed.

  16. tom

    I see there is a misunderstanding brewing over my position regarding this topic. I would never attempt to establish what a safe viral load of salmonella is for a dog, cat or human. I am not a biologist nor am I associated with any sort of medical research. Nonetheless, I am not certain the viral load in the product under scrutiny has been established. Furthermore, I have no idea how long a twice a day dose of said contaminated product would be tolerated or safely processed by any animal.
    Moreover, no one has addressed question of “When does a product become sufficiently contaminated to be deemed unsafe for the expected consuming market?” The pet food industry functions with virtually no regulation or oversight.
    I did not purchase a rotting deer carcass from along the road. Nor did I expect to receive tainted fowl. Natura is marketed as a relatively expensive and allegedly premium product. This representation has turned out to be completely mis-leading and I am unhappy about it. Had I no concern about whether my home and pet would be contaminated with unknown disease and sickness, I would be more inclined to gather carrion for my dog. We are all subject to our own standards as well as the expectation promulgated from our suppliers.
    I will no longer be purchasing any brand of commercial pet food. My dog will only be fed what I have personally prepared. The nutritional needs of most dogs can be met after doing a little research on the matter. Perhaps Natura might find this approach appealing one day in the future.

    1. Happy dogs

      I had some of the Innova cat food that was on the second recall list but none of my animals had gotten sick. Both my cat and dog ate it. I was told the second recall was a safety net because that food ran down the same belt as the first contaminated food. One thing that I personally keep on hand is a product called MMS. It is Sodium Chlorite which is liquid salt and Citric Acid. I mix one drop of Sodium Chlorite into 5 drops of Citric Acid time it for 3 minutes and add a 1/4 cup of cold water and I drink this or give it to my dogs. This is actually water purification treatment and it kills pathogenic microorganisms such as fungi, bacteria, viruses. A friend of mine has a young dog that came down with parvo and I gave this to him to use on the dog upon his request and it successfully killed the parvo virus and the dog is fine. I bought this from the health food store. He used the dosage suggested in Jim Humble’s book MMS THE MASTER MINERAL SOLUTION OF THE THIRD MILLENIUM. When I learned that my pets ate some of the recalled Natura I gave them MMS just to be safe. What the body doesn’t use of the chlorine Deoxide it expels as salt. Interestingly there is a new mouth wash and tooth paste out called CloSYS and it contains Chlorine Deoxide, it’s a wonderful product my dentist promotes.
      Chlorine Deoxide is safe to use on other large farm and zoo animals too. It’s not the kind of chlorine found in bleach products so don’t confuse it with that. I’m sure glad I learned about this product it’s my safety net.

  17. Jess

    Ok, so I need some help. I have a dog suffering from what we suspect to be IBD, and the vet recommends getting on a novel protein for about 8 weeks to help his GI tract calm down. My dog has been exposed to so much, we are looking at a kangaroo diet, but the only one I can find is the california natural one. I am afraid of getting this food after the recall. Does anyone have any thoughts on this? I certainly don’t want salmonella to upset his already inflamed GI tract! I am afraid to try him on raw right now if there are any unwanted microbes present in the raw diet, his GI tract may worsen in its state. Yikes, what a delima I have! Does anyone have any brand suggestions for novel proteins?

    1. Susan Thixton Author

      Jess – you can have your vet contact Rayne Clinical Nutrition. All human grade Rx foods. Also look at Just Food for Dogs – again all human grade – and they can make a diet specifically to meet your dogs needs.

    2. Happy dogs

      When ever my dog had an upset stomach the vet would have me boil organic chicken breast and mix this with white rice and a little cottage cheese this would calm the stomach right down and the dog loved it.
      Another dog food you may check out is GREAT LIFE. They cook it at a low temp for a longer time so as not to kill all of the nutrition but kill only the pathogens. The process is similar to how my friend vat pasturizes her raw milk on her organic dairy farm and sells it at many stores like Whole foods. Great Life also makes Pioneer Naturals, check into this food it’s new to me I just learned about it. It sounds like the best thing close to raw and safe.

  18. Ellie

    Some vets seem to be very opposed to raw feeding. It is much more easily digested than kibble. Even home cooking food is better than much of what is being sold as dog food these days. There are holistic vets that may be able to recommend recipes for a challenged pet.
    Buying meats from people who raise grass fed all natural meat is something to consider as well. Sometimes they are closer than you think.

  19. KLC

    Well, I just came upon this information. Too late perhaps, but my dog seems fine from his 30 LB bag of CN Kangaroo! Been going Grain-Free for some time now to improve my Goldens overall health (itchy ears, excessively licking paws, and a “matty” coat that NEVER looks brushed. Any advice from anyone? Hopefully one that will not break the bank, because we’ve been feeding CN for 3 years now and we are searching for ways to save! Poor guy only gets dead tennis balls!

  20. Marcia Fox

    I fed my Seal Point Lynx Bengal cat EVO dry Turkey and Chicken before I knew that lot was recalled. He got deathly ill, went down to 6.2 pounds and so far it has cost me over $1000. When I spoke to the Natura rep I got the run around. She insisted on a fecal exam in order to ‘go forward’ (I am not taking my cat back to the vet – he is too weak it is too traumatic) and my vet said that too much time has passed and the test will be negative. They said if I can prove their food poisoned my cat then they will pay the vet bills but not the cabs to the vet, etc. I had 6 nightmare weeks watching my cat practically die, afraid to leave him for a moment and then the struggle to nurse him back to health from the depths he had sunk to.
    I can’t believe how callous they are. Thankfully I have a wonderful vet and my cat had started gaining back weight, he is still boney and weak but at least he is walking around and looking better.
    My cats absolutely love that particular food and now I am afraid to feed it to them.

    1. Nancy

      I am sorry your cat waas so ill. And thrilled it has improved. I would be tempted to speak with superviser or higher up at EVO. AND have your vet send a letter. Almost always it is too late for fecal samples —
      My kitties had horrible diahrea from our bag of EVO. It was all gone by time I saw recall, small bad among 5 cats so they didn’t get a big dose.
      Didn’t they even offer a refund (I now save empty petfood bags in garage for several months)?
      My recovering cat adores that food but “never more”
      Good luck

      1. Marcia Fox

        My pet food supplier offered me a refund for the two recalled bags. They are the ones that advised me of the recall. I had been feeding it to my cat since I got it and he was getting sicker and sicker.
        Finally Natura said they would pay my vet bills ONLY, no other expenses, like the cab to the vet in the rain, etc. They have been horrible, they lied to me amongst other things.
        I am beside myself about this. My cat is still so sick, he can’t jump, hardly ever gets up and looks so sad when I look into his eyes. I am having the worst time getting him to eat and drink. I am trying everything but having been a victim of salmonella myself once, I can understand his weakness and refusing food.

    2. tom

      If you still have the suspect cat food and it was purchased in the state in which you live, you may contact your State Department of Agriculture, the State Department of Health/Infectious Disease as well as the US FDA.

      1. Marcia Fox

        That’s a good idea Tom.

    3. Erin M

      Marcia, your cats symptoms sound just like mine. Three cats became very sick eating Innova. One is still so sick she can’t walk more than a couple steps. I carry her to and from the litter etc. I just hope she gets well. I still would not call it. I know there is more to the Innova recall than they are saying. I’ve been reading a fair bit about the brand trying to find out if anyone’s vet has narrowed down the cause. It seems to be a set batch of symtoms so I’m sure it’s all related. I am so outraged that Innova obviously knows what is causing all the critically ill pets….but to cover their asses they are not divulging what they surely must know. We need to get treatment protocols in place. Vet bills so far 1000.00 and no further ahead trying to find the cause.

  21. Marcia Fox

    Erin, It just keeps getting worse and worse. Their rep called me and said that my vet told their vet that my cat never got sick from EVO and that he didn’t have Salmonella. I questioned her about it because of what I have been going through. She said however, that they were going to pay my vet bills anyway and to send her the invoices. I told her I would get back to her and immediately called my vet’s office and left a message regarding what she told me. He was very angry when he called me back and said he never told them anything like that. Then their vet called me (he is a very condescending person and difficult to talk to – a horrible experience) he said that if my vet didn’t send him Angel’s records right away they were going to close the case, he was so rude. Ugh. I asked him why he told the EVO rep that my vet said Angel never had Salmonella and didn’t get sick from their food. He totally denied ever saying anything to her and said that my vet never told him that. So when I tried to tell him that his rep lied to me he got even ruder, he wasn’t interested in what she said, just let’s get on with this. Anyway, after he got the records he called me back and said that even though I couldn’t PROVE that Angel go sick from their food he was willing to pay me for the first vet bill and ONLY THAT. Of course I am really getting DISGUSTED with their attitude, I am still nursing a very ill cat, he now weighs 6.5 pounds which means he has gained only three ounces with all the time and care I have been giving him. He still can barely walk, I cannot engage him in any play, I open about 6 different cans of food during the day and night to get him to lick the juice off the top because now he isn’t drinking water. I think he is just too weak and probably in pain still to walk around. His two sons weigh 23 and 15 pounds and are constantly trying to attack him now because he is so weak. I am about beside myself from this and it is so upsetting that such an important company like Proctor & Gamble, a company that I used all of my life, could be so cruel and petty over a few dollars (I only want them to pay my expenses on this) when they should be doing all they can do to rectify the damage they caused by poisoning our innocent pets!!! They think they can threaten and push us around and we will give in and it will all go away for them, but a lot of us are home nursing deathly ill pets. Their vet also had the nerve to tell me that Angel’s symptoms were not caused by salmonella! What a jerk, really, he was so horrible to talk to, I hope you don’t have to go through the same experience Erin.
    Good luck with your cat!!

    1. Ellie

      This sounds like a horrible nightmare you are going through. A lawyer seems to be in order.

      Please consider feeding you cat some raw meats instead of canned cat food. Most commercial cat foods have very low grade ingredients in them. If your kitty is that weak he needs real nourishment that is easily digested.

      Stella & Chewy’s makes a really quality freeze dried food that even really picky eaters will eat. It was a great help to me and my dog. They make cat food as well. It is organic and the meats are from grass fed animals with no injections. It is all American made quality stuff. At least look into it. The woman started the company because of a pet that was very sick from commercial foods. You can read about on their site. I’m really not advertizing for them but have had wonderful results with their food.

  22. Marcia Fox

    Thank you for the advise Ellie. I am a little hesitant to try the raw food just yet. I want to wait till he is a bit stronger. I tried him on it once before but he wasn’t interested. I have been cooking him organic chicken breast and turkey and wild swordfish which he likes but my vet wants him on cat food as well so he has a balanced diet. He also likes freeze dried fish and chicken treats. Being that I can’t get him to drink I don’t give him too many of them because they are dry. I want to save his appetite for wet food and I mix water into his food every time I feed him. I’m slowly getting there but it has been stressful. I want to find a new food for my cats now they won’t be eating EVO Turkey & Chicken. Someone suggested Orjien.

    1. Happy dogs

      Marcia check out Great Life and Pioneer Natural pet foods. I just switched my dogs and cat to these. They are cooked at a low temp to kill harmful bacteria but not destroy nutrition. It’s like feeding raw. I looked on the unbiased pet food reviews and the Great Life had no red flags at all and it’s rated five stars.

      1. Marcia Fox

        Yes, my darling Angel went into convulsions and now he is dead after 10 weeks of suffering. I feel so guilty for feeding him that poison. And I have vet bills of over $4000!

  23. Ellie

    I can’t with good conscience recommend any commercial cat food. Your cooking for him is certainly much better than what you will find in most commercial foods. Manny of the foods that were once considered higher grade have been bought up by large companies that then turn them into the same bad stuff they make under other names.
    I understand you being nervous feeding him just your own cooking but you are using ingredients from good sources and they have not had the nutrition cooked out of them in a processing plant. If you look at the end of any ingredient list on a pet food label you will see a list of synthetic vitamins that have been added. That for the most part is what pet’s are obtaining their nutrition from. The food ingredients are cooked at such high temps that there is really no appreciable nutrition left in them. Maybe find a good supplement obtained from natural ingredients to add to the food you cook for him? It is still better than what you will find in a can.

  24. Carolina

    I just recently bought Innova Grain Free Dog Food, and after reading all of this and having a colleague inform me that P&G had bought the company makes me really worried about what on earth im feeding my dogs.

    Any recommendations!???

    1. Happy dogs

      I switched from Innova to Fromm and Pioneer Naturals, Great Life. The Great Life and Pioneer Natural has a five star rating. My dogs all look fantastic with beautiful coats too. Switch them over very slowly especially because the Great Life products are like feeding a raw diet. They are coated with freeze dried ingredients and the kibble is cooked at a slow rate low temp so as to kill pathogens but not kill the nutrition. The Pioneer Natural canned food is wonderful all my dogs are crazy about it and my friend has 9 dogs and they all love it! Another thing check out William Cusicks book on line Canine Nutrition. He tells what food is best for each breed of dog. He did 20 years of research on this.. I hope this helps.

    2. Marcia Fox

      THROW IT IN THE GARBAGE! My cat just died from their poisoned food!

      1. Happy dogs

        Marcia I’m so sorry for the loss of your cat. I’m sure it will be hard to trust another pet food co again. Nothing in this world is 100% trust worthy not even the food we put in our own mouths. There are many more cats that need good homes, shelters are full of cats just waiting for good homes. As I always say there are sooo many animals waiting to be loved.

        1. Marcia Fox

          Hi Happy Dogs, I have his two sons but it isn’t the same. Angel was one of those cats that connects to your soul. I feel so guilty as I was the one in-trusted with his care. I thought I was feeding him the best food available. I tried nursing him back to health for ten grueling weeks, it was heartbreaking to see him wither away until finally he went into convulsions. I think I nearly died myself that night. And EVO/NATURA/P&G have been horrible about everything. They really put me through the wringer and I have over $4000 in vet bills to pay, one little can of cat ashes and the biggest heartache I ever had : (

          1. tom

            Marcia, There is nothing that will console you at this time. You are entitled to your emotions. Furthermore, I do appreciate your sentiments toward P&G. A lot of the compliance and legal personnel there have been handed their own individual “hand basket” and each is foolishly filling it as fast as they can. The only known reproach is to go to P&G’s web site, take note of all their products and rid your home of every P&G product and vow to never allow the firm to realize one cent of profit from you again. This conglomerate makes absolutely nothing that you can’t live without or substitute. Tom

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